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Tuesday, June 29, 1999
Pres. Hosni Mubarak : All the Arabs want the peace process to move forward. They are encouraging Arafat to go ahead. At the same time, we are encouraging- will encourage Barak to go ahead because all of them want the peace process to come to an end on fair basis so as we could reach lasting peace. And then the cooperation will begin all over the area, including the Israelis. President Mubarak Says Trust Must Be Restored Charlie Rose: Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak is in Washington, talking with President Clinton and others. He comes to Washington to talk about foreign policy and economic issues. We spoke with him at Blair House earlier today What do you hope to achieve from all these-- this- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Really I came here as usual to meet with the president, the secretary of state, the secretary of defense, and other members in the Senate with whom I have very good relations since long time ago, to exchange views, to see what we can do to speak about the peace process, see how could we work in the future with the new government. You know that Egypt is a country which opened the key process, the peace process by key-- Charlie Rose: With the treaty between Egypt and Israel? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Sadat made his initiative, the Camp David, the peace agreement. Then after that everything is going very well. Without this opening by Egypt, I think It would have been much difficult- much more difficult for any country to establish peace with Israel. Charlie Rose: Then what can you do now? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Now, I know Barak very well. I had contacts with him even before the elections. And he told me that he’s going with same track that Rabin- Rabin was a very good man. And I hope that he could continue the peace process in a way that would give the Palestinians their rights as much as they can so as peace prevails and the cooperation can start all over the area. Charlie Rose: Now, what if he says- to you, "First, I have the problem in Lebanon, and I want to deal with President Assad; then, I will get to the Palestinian question"? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Look, the core of the whole problem is the Palestinian issue. Without solving the Palestinian issue or going through implementing what was agreed upon in Oslo, Wye River, and these things, this will never build trust between the parties. Charlie Rose: So the most important thing Barak can do is deal to the Palestinian question first. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: You have to deal with Palestinian first. When the Palestinian issue moves forward, I think the Syrians will feel that they are- there is a genuine- they may resume negotiations. Charlie Rose: It is said that you’ve asked the President to use his good office to encourage Prime-Minster-elect Barak to do something about the settlements. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: There are many issues, just something to be done with them- the settlements, the issue of Jerusalem, many issues which should be decided from the beginning. I ask of the President and I ask also Barak in the same direction. I’m not just asking the President alone. I start with Barak and tell him, "You should do something to calm down the situation, then leave this for the negotiations." That was agreed upon. Charlie Rose: What would calm down the situation? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Everybody- new settlements- the Har Homa, the Ras al-Amoud settle- area. These are arousing the feeling of the people, not only in Palestinian, but in the whole Arab World. We should do something to make the situation calm down so as they could negotiate all issues. Charlie Rose: Well, what’s one thing that would do that? One thing that would calm down the situation in your view- what would it be? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: No, it’s not only one thing. Different things. You have to work to assure the Palestinians they are going to implement the agreement which has been signed before. It would be a very good step forward. Then, at the same time, they have to halt building settlements now until they find a way, during the negotiations or negotiating the final status. Charlie Rose: So, a pronouncement on settlements would send a good signal? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: For sure. Charlie Rose: What if Mr. Barak says, "I’m gonna skip the withdrawal for now and move directly to a final settlement; let’s get at the core issue- Jerusalem, statehood"? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Look, I hear this. Charlie Rose: That’s four "looks". Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I heard this in the media. Charlie Rose: Yeah? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: But this would never work. Confidence-building measures should take place. Implementing the agreements which was agreed upon and signed should take place. Without these, I think nobody will trust each other. Charlie Rose: Mr. Barak comes to the Prime-minister-ship with trust there. He doesn’t have to earn trust. He already has trust. Doesn’t he? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: He has to earn a trust once with the Arabs- the Palestinian, with the Arabs. Charlie Rose: But he was part of the Rabin-Peres government. They had trust. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Rabin- Charlie Rose: And he had trust. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Rabin was doing very well. And Peres also was doing very well. He was negotiating everything. And he was containing the Palestinians- as far as the Palestinian are contained. And [unintelligible] with what could be done for them. I think went easy the whole way. Charlie Rose: The biggest problem you had with Mr. Netanyahu, other than he didn’t- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I had no problem with Mr. Netanyahu-as Egypt and Israel—yeah. Charlie Rose: With his policies. Partly was you didn’t believe he had confidence in the peace process, but also you didn’t believe there was confidence among the Arab nations, the Palestinians, and Mr. Netanyahu’s government. Confidence was not there. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: The confidence is build on as far as whenever you give a word and you honor it. If you don’t honor your word, this will damage the whole confidence. This is what happened with the previous government. Charlie Rose: What’s the role of the United States in all of this? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: The United States is a key in the peace process since we started it between Egypt and Israel during Menachem Begin and Sadat. Charlie Rose: As an honest broker? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: They were playing a very good role, constructive role until we reached the peace agreement. Charlie Rose: And then? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: And then started to continue with us on the Palestinian issue. They helped a lot. And I think President Clinton is eager just to conclude something concerning the Palestinian in the coming 18 months. Charlie Rose: In other words, he feels like it would be important for his presidency to make significant progress? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: And we are ready to have it. Charlie Rose: And he said that to you? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: He said that? Charlie Rose: "I want end- do something for the Middle East before I leave office"? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I think it’s very important for him to do that, very important for the Palestinians for something like this to be done, very important for peace and stability in the whole area. And very important for the image of the United States. Charlie Rose: To do what? Give me a specific. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: To continue negotiations, to implement the agreements which has been reached- mainly. The Oslo Agreement- it was not respected. The Hebron Agreement was not fully implemented. The Wye River is not implemented at all. So, how could you tell me you trust this man or that man with all these things are not being implemented? Charlie Rose: So, You want the President to encourage the new prime minister- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes, yes. Charlie Rose: -to implement all the agreements. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: That’s right. And I’m going to speak also with the prime minister in the same direction. Charlie Rose: Yeah. And what will you ask Yasser Arafar? What did he do? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Arafat? He has nothing to do. Charlie Rose: Well, he does. Come on. The Israelis are very concerned about- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: What? Charlie Rose: -Security. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Security- he is doing his best in security. I tell you an example. The Israeli government released some of the terrorist there or some of the- they call "terrorist group" After two days after they released, then they ask Arafat to put them in jail. I cannot understand. What’s the meaning of this? Arafat is doing his best for the security. Sometimes he reports or the Israelis give them warning whenever he has something Israelis stability there. Charlie Rose: In other words, he gives Israelis information if he is concerned about some security aspect. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Because he heard some stories so as to cooperate. Both of them are cooperating to work against terrorists. Charlie Rose: Can you engage the peace process on all fronts at one time? Or do you need just to focus on the Palestinian question because, as you say, it’s at the core? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I told you from the beginning the Palestinian Issue is the core of the whole problem. If I didn’t feel that the Palestinian problem is moving forward, I will never I’m telling as a person, I will never trust any other track. And the other track will never resume negotiations as far as they have no confidence in what was going on before. Charlie Rose: So does that mean that President Assad, for example, will not want to engage in negotiations with Prime Minister Barak until he’s satisfied that the peace process is under way? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: No, I’m not saying this. I’m saying that, when Barak moves forward with the Palestinian problem, implements the agreements, this will give hope to President Assad that the really working for peace. He may resume negotiations with the Israelis. Assad wants, is ready for peace. But confidence methods should be shown just to give him, make him trust what’s going Charlie Rose: How do stand with other members of the Arab community? How does Egypt stand? Are there supportive of you? Do you have their confidence? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: For sure. Charlie Rose: There’s a united Arab Pres. Hosni Mubarak: For sure I have the confidence of all the Arab community. Those are all members of the Arab League. I have their confidence. I exchange views with them. I meet with them. I listen to them. I know whenever I say something I know what is in their mind. Charlie Rose: So in a sense, as we approach this very important time after the election of Ehud Barak, there is in a sense a common vision and a united front in the Arab world to encourage the Palestinians, to encourage the Israelis and to encourage the United States to Pull together? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: That’s right. All the Arabs want the peace process to move forward. They are encouraging Arafat to go ahead. At the same time we are encouraging- will encourage Barak to go ahead because all of them want the peace process to come to an end on fair basis so as we could reach lasting peace. And then the cooperation will begin all over the area, including the Israelis. Charlie Rose: How about Iraq and Iran? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: You are asking a different question. What do you want from that? Charlie Rose: How do you see it? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Iraq the people are suffering. I kept saying, "We have to find the ways and the means to help the people from the suffering they are living in." They have difficult times, no medicine, no food. They are not living nearly, although Iraq could have been the richest country in the area. They have all revenues. They have a huge fertile land. They have everything for them. But, after what happened in between Iraq and Kuwait, it created very bad atmosphere, the people now are suffering. Charlie Rose: And so what should what are you recommending the president of the united States do when he consults you and asks for your opinion about the relationship between the United States and Iraq? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I told the president before, "you should do whatever you can do for the people for the time being." Charlie Rose: Lift the embargo? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: to say what that we should remove Saddam Hussein .. I tell you this is the decision of the people of Iraq, whether they can or cannot now. But removing the head of the state from outside forces is not appreciated. Charlie Rose: So, any effort to do that should be abandoned simply because it would cause ill will in the Arab World. Or there are those who might say, "Gee, that’s a good idea, but don’t Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I could tell you so many countries doesn’t want to deal with Saddam Hussein Charlie Rose: Don’t want to deal with? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: But- but- but nobody will participate in removing Saddam Hussein. This is the decision and the will of the people of Iraq. We cannot just Charlie Rose: But can you imagine that happening when you understand his Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Anything. Charlie Rose: Despotic dictatorship. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Anything could happen. Anything could happen. Charlie Rose: Can you imagine the people of Iraq Pres. Hosni Mubarak: They can Charlie Rose: -rising up. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: They can. Charlie Rose: It’s not likely. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: But don’t ask me how. Charlie Rose: How? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I don’t know. I cannot tell you. Charlie Rose: But do you think it’s Pres. Hosni Mubarak: They can. This is a decision of the people. Charlie Rose: Is it likely? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Even of a dictatorship- the people are capable to remove a head of state. Charlie Rose: Would you be happy to see that happen? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: This is their fate. This is their decision. Charlie Rose: You would be happy to see it happen? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: It’s not a matter of happy or not happy. Charlie Rose: It would be a great- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I would like the Iraq community to work with the whole Arab community. Charlie Rose: It would be good for the Iraqi people. It would be good for the rest of the world Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Maybe, maybe. Charlie Rose: -If Saddam Hussein was not in power. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Maybe for the Arab World. Charlie Rose: It would be good if he was not in power Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Maybe. Charlie Rose: And for the people of Iraq. Pres.Hosni Mubarak: Maybe. Charlie Rose: Why not "yes"? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I’m not going to give you that answer at this point. Charlie Rose: Why not? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Just keep it for myself. Charlie Rose: It’s clear that you think it would be a good idea. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Maybe Charlie Rose: OK. Iran Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yeah. Charlie Rose: What can the United States do to encourage moderation in Iran? What should we do? And what should president Khatami do? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I think Khatami is one of the moderate elements in Iran. But still as far as I know that they still - they are working mass destructive weapons, as I hear from the United States, which is very dangerous. And we call upon - we stated them a call that this area should be clear from all mass destructive weapons, including Iran and Israel- Charlie Rose: Right. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: And any other country who may have this, So, I think The United States should work on this issue, which is vital and dangerous on the whole area. Charlie Rose: To eliminate nuclear weapons spreading? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes, All over the area. Charlie Rose: Including Israel. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Including Israel - maybe the Israelis would be upset from that, but this is a principle, We cannot exclude one and ask the other to remove his-- Charlie Rose: Do you have any reason to believe - because of your own experience, your own knowledge – that the spread of radical Islamic fundamentalism of the most militant kind has been stymied, has been- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: Reduced? Charlie Rose: --Stopped? Reduced Pres. Hosni Mubarak: No, I cannot tell that has stopped, It’s still- Charlie Rose: Is it the threat-- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: It’s still And it will be the threat in the new Century. And I said several times. I called upon – there should be an international summit held in New York or anywhere else to put good ideas or good steps just to work against these terroristic groups. It’s spreading everywhere. It is in the Far East. It is in Afghanistan. It is in Iran.(unintelligible) in Sudan. It is in sometimes places in Europe. Charlie Rose: Right. Pres. Hosni Mubarak: In the United States, In Egypt, in Algiers - anywhere. If these are going to be left like this in the new era, in the new century, it would be very dangerous- much more danger than what we call the "shortage of water" and these. This will be the most destructive weapons in the whole word. Charlie Rose: Why don’t you lead that effort? Why don’t you call for a conference? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: I called for the conference several times. Even I have talked with so many countries in Europe, with the British, with john Major, with Tony Blair, and with others, with the United States . At the beginning they didn’t believe me. They took it lightly, when the terrorists action started to spread everywhere, they started to think of it. But I’m still saying there should be a summit to convene mainly for discussing the ways and means to be taken to stand against terrorism. It will be the most dangerous phenomena in the world coming century. In case we don’t know, at the beginning when I said it they took it lightly. When they start spreading everywhere, it became very dangerous. You have the World Trade Center, You have what happened in Chicago. You have what happened in- Charlie Rose: Oklahoma City, from a different- Pres. Hosni Mubarak: In so many places now in the states. It’s not only characterized for Egypt or for any other country or Algiers or Tunisia. No. It’s an international phenomenon. Unless we take tough measure, and stop hosting this terroristic group, we are all going to suffer. Charlie Rose: Do you - What’s the most important thing to do – other than organizing – to stop terrorism? What does the world have to do? Pres. Hosni Mubarak: At least- there should be countries who host these terroristic group and ask for asylum and giving them asylum. They are killers. Charlie Rose: It should be unacceptable that the Afghanistan government, the Taliban regime, is giving refuge to Osama Bin Laden? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Not only Afghanistan, Afghanistan, Iran, Britain—so many countries, so many elements in the United Kingdom. And nobody want to take any measure of them. Charlie Rose: Should outlaw any refuge for terrorists, so they have nowhere to go ? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Look, they put them in one of the islands in the middle of the ocean. Measures should be Taken. Charlie Rose: Yeah. pres. Hosni Mubarak: And increasing more and more. We have to find a way out. Before the summit , there should be experts. Reports said, discussed and put a very good- well- studied people how to act against this phenomenon. Charlie Rose: It can be done? pres. Hosni Mubarak: It can be done for sure Charlie Rose: It can be stopped ? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose: And it must be. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose: You’ve had a good relationship with president Clinton. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose: There are no issues of any significance in the bilateral relationship. pres. Hosni Mubarak: I think that - by definitions everything’s going well. Charlie Rose: Yeah pres. Hosni Mubarak: We have a good relation with him. I have a good relation with the Congress and the Senate, So, there is not real problem between the two nations. Our relation with the United States is a strategic relation. It’s not a temporary relation or a tactical relation. It is built on very solid basis. So, whenever I come here, I have to discuss issues of mutual concern, see what’s happening in the Middle East, what’s happening in Iran, In Libya, in Iraq, other countries, what could be done exchanging views and exchanging ideas. Charlie Rose: A candid opinion- do you think they Egyptian story - your economic story, the role you want to play in the region as a dominant force - has been told well? Do you think – I know what you want to do here in part is convince the American business to come to Egypt. pres. Hosni Mubarak: We are trying to convince the American businessmen. They started . But not with the size which we expected . Anyway , I think they started coming now. I think Lucent is going to declare something on Thursday to come for- Charlie Rose: Lucent Technologies. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose: Huge phone company. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes, we are looking forward for much more participation with the American businessmen. Charlie Rose: You have had-- and this is not to flatter you or your officials-- a very, very good economic record. pres. Hosni Mubarak: That's right. Charlie Rose: Economic growth is up above 5 percent? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. It's about 6 percent now. Charlie Rose: Inflation is way down? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Inflation is about 3-point-something. Charlie Rose: Your currency relationship is very strong. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Touch wood. Charlie Rose: Sorry? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Touch wood. Charlie Rose: Yes. So, how'd you do it? What's the Egyptian message about its own economy? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Look, the reform of the economy is an ongoing process. It will never stop, as well as the reform in politics- political reform, social reform. It's all ongoing processes. We are working hard to improve our economy- more and more, find more jobs. We have very giant projects now in Egypt now we are looking forward to completing. Charlie Rose: By the private sector or the public sector? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Many now private sector. Mind you, I'd like to tell you we have 19 new cities built in the desert. One of them is 45 kilometers near Cairo. It's called Tenth of Ramadan City. It has over 1,000 factories, all private sector. Other cities- all private sector. Now, I am preventing the government to participate in any industry or anything now. Charlie Rose: Is that part of the reason for the success of the Egyptian economy? pres. Hosni Mubarak: For sure. For sure. For sure. Charlie Rose: Where did you learn that lesson? pres. Hosni Mubarak: That lesson ? From life. Charlie Rose: From life. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose: Trust the private sector? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose: Or encourage the private sector? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes, I encourage them very well and moving all opposite which could enter that. I was sometimes- I think that the- the- the rich people take him to the land, tell them, " Do this here. It's very important." I was encouraging everybody. I visited them several times in one year. I could visit them- the new cities- maybe six or seven or eight times a year, see what problems they need, why are they slowing down, and I immediately on the spot I remove all the obstacles for them. Now, we have so many projects. Charlie Rose: Now, why do you need aid from America, then? The "$ 2-2.5 billion"? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Why do you say "$ 2-1/2 billion"? Charlie Rose: How much is it? pres. Hosni Mubarak: It's now $577, plus the military aid. Charlie Rose: The military's how much? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Charlie Rose :How much is the military? Pres. Hosni Mubarak : Military ?$1.3- Charlie Rose: So $1.3 and it's ..OK Pres. Hosni Mubarak :Why do we need it? Charlie Rose :yeah. Pres. Hosni Mubarak :Why Israel need it ? We took it Israel and Egypt took it at one time after the Camp David Accord. Charlie Rose :Right. Pres. Hosni Mubarak : Now, it is the view- the economic aid to Israel is reduced and added to military. Any way -I don't envy them. I'm not asking all that. I say that the economic aid I'm sure that is not going to stay forever. Sometimes it's going to disappear. That's why when they started reducing it I didn't oppose. I said, "Go ahead." Our economy 's going very well. I thank the American administration and the American Congress and Senate for the help rendered us all this time because this helped us for the economy to move forward. Charlie Rose : I want to come back to that , but let me just come back- you mentioned the United states and the military aid. How do you asses the way the United States is playing it's role as the remaining super power in the World? What advice do you give the president about the role the United States cause it stands unique because of its military power ,it's economic force. pres. Hosni Mubarak: But who knows in the future what could happen? What could -may be China after that. May be Russia. May be the European Community, You never know. `Charlie Rose :Right. Pres. Hosni Mubarak : But for the time being the United States is the Unique power in the World. Charlie Rose : Does the world, in your judgment, want to see the United States do things like what it did for the Kosovo -in Kosovo? Pres. Hosni Mubarak :Look What they did in Kosovo is very good because they saved lives there. But some countries, some people ,are not pleased with this. Charlie Rose: yeah. Pres. Hosni Mubarak ; other said, "All right, we-as Egyptians ..It's all right because they are defending the Muslims in Kosovo and the Albania." Others may say ,"No" the World have different opinions. Charlie Rose: And what does the President of Egypt say? pres. Hosni Mubarak: That ..I told you my opinion now. Charlie Rose; It's a good idea? President Hosni Mubarak: It's a good idea. Charlie Rose: yeah. pres. Hosni Mubarak: But I told the Americans ,"Sometimes when trying to send the ground forces there before reaching an agreement for an attack, it would be very dangerous. Don’t send your forces now on this (unintelligible) agreement." Charlie Rose : With things going so well for Egypt, With things going so well for you. pres. Hosni Mubarak: That’s good. Charlie Rose :You are now the longest -Serving President of Egypt. pres. Hosni Mubarak: That’s good. Charlie Rose: In a long time. Why do you maintain -stay in power? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Me? Charlie Rose: You. pres. Hosni Mubarak: I still have a big agenda to do in this country. Very big agenda .As far as I have the support of the people and this is the decision of the people, I would have left. Charlie Rose; Your people -your party has 95 percent of the parliament. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Look not 95 percent. Charlie Rose :How much? Pres. Hosni Mubarak : When we went through elections ,our party just named some names. Fifty percent of them didn’t succeed. Other succeed from the other party. Charlie Rose: Yeah? pres. Hosni Mubarak: But the- we have about ,may be 90 percent, but in the party itself if they are not satisfied with the president they will oppose him. We are not like other countries that could agree on the president blindly. In any law to be discussed ,they make amendment. They Change points, They do so many things. Charlie Rose: For a strong man, you seem- it seems necessary to maintain a tight political control. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Not to that extent, as you think. We have institutions. You may not understand this. We have fully independent, honorable judicial system. Nobody could interfere in the judicial system to the extent that so many cases raised by the government and the government lose it. Secondly, we have an elected parliament- free. We never interfere in the election of the parliament. You may tell me there is some problem, but the government never interfere in that. We have a free press. Sometimes here in the United States when I am meeting with the Jewish community they brought to me some articles from Al Ahram and they're all about Semitic-- Charlie Rose: " How could you allow this to happen?" they say. pres. Hosni Mubarak: I told them, "The governmental newspaper- and frankly I'm not governmental." All circles writing that. They think that the governmental newspaper we could tell them, " Don't do this. Do that." Charlie Rose: You think that in Egypt you have as much democracy and as much free press as you need? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yes. Much, much, much free press as I need? Charlie Rose: Yes. pres. Hosni Mubarak: No. Charlie Rose: As the country needs. Pres.Hosni Mubarak: We have full freedom for the press. Full freedom to the extent they could- one of the newspapers kept [ unintelligible] the prime minister for three years every day. Charlie Rose: How about NGOs, these non-governmental organizations? pres. Hosni Mubarak: What do you want to ask me about? Ask, ask. I'm ready to answer the question. Charlie Rose: Why clamp down on that? pres. Hosni Mubarak: Why? Charlie Rose: Yeah. pres. Hosni Mubarak: We have 14,600 NGO organizations. Charlie Rose: Yeah. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Fourteen thousand six hundred. It started long ago - maybe 200, 300 years ago. The new law is much far better than the old law, much far better. They are--- Charlie Rose: Because you're clamping down? pres. Hosni Mubarak: What? Charlie Rose: Why is it better? pres. Hosni Mubarak: It's better? I'll tell you some points in it. One point is in the old law not a single organization can form an organization without the approval of the minister of social affairs. Now, you could give the application. Within 60 days, if there is no answer, you should go on right away automatically. Secondly, the government before that in the old law the government could cancel any organization, remove it complete. In this new law, no. The government had no authority to cancel, do anything. They have to go to the arbitration and who doesn't like their petition go to the courts. Cancellation or any of these removing the chairmen should be through the court. It was not in the old law. Old law, the government could cancel, do anything whatever they like. So the big fuss which being made about this is only for four or six organizations. And you know that these four and six we say that, "Whenever you have donation or any incoming, you should report." Like in the United States. And the government would like to know where the money's going to be spent. Maybe going for terrorists. Charlie Rose: Right. pres. Hosni Mubarak: This is the main issue which six or eight from 14,600- I could give you a [unintelligible] of the law, and you read it. If I have the old law, I give it. You will find a great difference about that. Saying, "All the laws being discussed quickly in the parliament." This law stayed two years, discussing it. Two years. Then this organization complained to me. " Where is the law, Mr. President?" So, I asked of the government to submit the law to the parliament. Charlie Rose: How long do you want to be president? pres. Hosni Mubarak: I don't know. Charlie Rose: At least another term. pres. Hosni Mubarak: I beg your pardon? Charlie Rose: At least another six years pres. Hosni Mubarak: Ah, for the coming term. Charlie Rose: Yeah. pres. Hosni Mubarak: All right. Charlie Rose: Right. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Yeah. Charlie Rose: Why don't you have a vice president? pres. Hosni Mubarak: The constitution doesn't force me to appoint a vice president. When somebody at the beginning in 1993 told me, " You should appoint a vice president"-- Charlie Rose: You said? pres. Hosni Mubarak: He told- somebody wrote me several messages, " We are not a monarchy. Don't appoint a vice president." There is no vice president anywhere in the world except in the United States according to your constitution. Charlie Rose: But you were a vice president. pres. Hosni Mubarak: Ah. President Sadat was lucky to select me. |
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